Thinking In Sound: Why Daniel Payne Has Never Been a Fan of Silence
Daniel Payne is a music supervisor with over 20 years of experience in the creative and music industries. He is the co-founder of Twelve Decibels, a London-based creative music supervision agency, partnering with some of the world’s leading brands and agencies to deliver innovative music solutions.
Throughout his career, Daniel has held pivotal roles in A&R at prestigious companies such as Universal Music Publishing, Zomba Publishing, and Jive Records, where he developed a keen eye for identifying and nurturing talent, while collaborating with globally successful recording artists and songwriters.
In addition to his A&R expertise, Daniel has taken on creative and leadership roles at some of the UK’s leading music supervision companies creating award winning work.
LBB> When you’re working on a new brief or project, what’s your typical starting point? How do you break it down and how do you like to generate your ideas or response?
Daniel> Before we start any research it’s vital to fully understand what emotion/tone the client is trying to achieve and how the music is going to support the narrative. Naturally there’s sometimes a disconnect between how someone describes an emotional response to music, verses how music actually makes you feel.
In these instances, I create an initial playlist that acts as a sound palette to pinpoint those feelings so we’re all on the same page from the start.
Then there’s the style/genre… in most cases there are a number of routes and genres to achieve the same thing. We usually divide these up around the Twelve Decibels team and always regularly review to help give perspective and stop the music rabbit hole getting too deep!
LBB> Music and sound are in some ways the most collaborative and interactive forms of creativity - what are your thoughts on this? Do you prefer to work solo or with a gang - and what are some of your most memorable professional collaborations?
Daniel> I’m 100% a believer in a collaborative form of creativity and have always worked in that way - from being a sound engineer in studios, assisting record producers, in A&R and working with artists / songwriters to develop their music and records - right through to my career as a music supervisor, I’ve always built teams to work and collaborate with.
While I enjoy working solo to focus on specific tasks, I really do value the process and rewards that come from working with a team.
I’ve been extremely lucky to have had the opportunity in my career to work with incredible people. Some of my most memorable collaborations have been working on albums with the likes of Steve Lipson who has produced records for Grace Jones, Annie Lennox, Rolling Stones and Billie Eilish - an absolute master class in record producing, and Johnny Douglas who worked with the late George Michael. Such inspiring people to be around and learn from.
LBB> What’s the most satisfying part of your job and why?
Daniel> Seeing one of my ideas come to life on screen is highly rewarding, but the most fulfilling aspect of my job and career has been training and assisting other supervisors and building brilliant teams. Watching amazingly talented and creative people grow has been incredibly rewarding and satisfying over the years.
I’ve recently launched Twelve Decibels with a few wonderful supervisors that I’ve worked with for many years. I’ve loved the process of building not just a team but a whole company from scratch. The joy truly lies in the collaboration and the unexpected moments of brilliance that comes from working with a team. It's those shared 'aha!' moments, the spontaneous creative sessions, or the team’s sighs of relief when we nail it.
LBB> As the advertising industry changes, how do you think the role of music and sound is changing with it?
Daniel> Great question! They're no longer just background elements; they're integral to the narrative, enhancing emotional response and audience connection. We’ve seen a surge in projects that capitalise on musical trends around social media.
This really requires the team at Twelve Decibels to be agile, adapting quickly to the preferences of the audience, navigating the complexities of music licensing and seamlessly integrating the right tracks. The adaptability and immediacy of digital platforms really pushes us to be innovate with our ideas to make sure we stand out against all the noise out there.
LBB> Who are your musical or audio heroes and why? And when it comes to your particular field, whether sound design or composing, are there any particular ideas or pioneers that you go back to frequently or who really influence your thinking about the work you do?
Daniel> Having started my music career in A&R, many of my musical heroes are the geniuses behind the records—incredible producers and songwriters like Trevor Horn, Steve Lipson, Andrew Weatherall, Jimmy Jam & Terry Lewis, Timbaland and Max Martin. The art of crafting a record has always fascinated me, and I’ve spent countless hours poring over the credits and interviews to find out who was involved in the creation process.
My real passion started with early hip-hop. Artists like Stetsasonic, Jungle Brothers, Mantronix, Steinski, 45 King and The Soul Sonic Force. These guys were pioneers in sampling and beat making. They opened my ears to other genres, sounds and artists through their use in sampling.
All I would ever want to do was find the source of that sample. We didn’t have databases like “who sampled” at the time, so it became a bit of an obsessive treasure hunt… who could get there first! I often find myself pulling on these references in searches. These guys really knew how to spot and sample a hidden gem.
LBB> When you’re working on something that isn’t directly sound design or music (let's say going through client briefs or answering emails) - are you the sort of person who needs music and noise in the background or is that completely distracting to you? What are your thoughts on ‘background’ sound and music as you work?
Daniel> I absolutely prefer to have background music or ambient noise. It really helps me stay focused. I’ve always worked in environments where music is playing, so I’ve never been a fan of silence! Even if it’s when I’m doing some chores around the house, it’s my chance to listen to new releases and discover new music without worrying if it fits a particular brief.
LBB> I guess the quality of the listening experience and the context that audiences listen to music/sound in has changed over the years. There’s the switch from analogue to digital and now we seem to be divided between bad-ass surround-sound immersive experiences and on-the-go, low quality sound (often the audio is competing with a million other distractions) - how does that factor into how you approach your work?
Daniel> I’ve spent hours sitting in studios and mastering suites trying to perfect the mix on a track, trying to get it to sound just the way I want it to be heard on a home system, a club, or on the radio. I think we need to accept that a big percentage of music is now listened to on laptops, phone speakers, adequate headphones or in a noisy space.
What it does do is really push us to make sure that the music cuts through, no matter how it’s being played.
Ironically, from a production perspective I love artists like Burial, who has really pushed the boundaries on what we perceive to be the perfect sounding record. By taking all the lo-fi background noise and interference we all worked so hard on to remove and putting it front and centre of a mix and track!
LBB> On a typical day, what does your ‘listening diet’ look like? Do you have a collection of music/sounds and what shape does it take (are you a vinyl nerd, do you have hard drives full of random bird sounds, are you a hyper-organised Spotify-er…)?
Daniel> Firstly, I’d love to dedicate this question to the people that broke into my storage unit a few years back and helped themselves to about 30 years’ worth of vinyl collecting. I’d built the collection up from all my years A&R record hunting, blagging a lot from other labels and publishers (we’ve all done it!), rarities, one off pressings, etc - a very sad day indeed.
Luckily, I’m pretty organised and I had started the process of converting as much of my collection as I could digitally, so I had a bit of a head start in building up my playlists in Spotify. I’ve got my eye on a shiny new turntable and speakers too - much to my partner’s dismay!
I still produce music occasionally and I do love a field recording! I make a lot of my sound kits and samples using my own recordings and processing. So, in answer to the question, yes, I do have hard drives full of completely random sounds I’ve captured over the years, but I think I’ll pass on trying to catalogue it.
LBB> Outside of the music and sound world, what sort of art or topics really excite you and do you ever relate that back to music (e.g. history buffs who love music that can help you travel through time, gamers who love interactive sound design… I mean it really could be anything!!)
Daniel> I’m a gamer at heart! It’s my go to when I need to shut out some of the noise or have a moment of being transported somewhere very quickly. The gaming industry has evolved and advanced so rapidly. Some of the storytelling and world building far outweighs what we get from most TV shows and films.
It’s very easy to get invested in the story quickly, and it’s much more immersive than other media platforms. Music and sound design play a huge part in that world and narrative building. With the likes of Sony releasing the 3D headphones for the PS5, it has the ability to pull you in even further. Sorry, I’ve gone back to sound again!
LBB> Let’s talk travel! It’s often cited as one of the most creatively inspiring things you can do - I’d love to know what are the most exciting or inspiring experiences you’ve had when it comes to sound and music on your travels?
Daniel> Some of the most memorable experiences I’ve had include attending music festivals and industry music events in different countries and exploring local music scenes. Heading to Miami for WMC and getting to see Daft Punk play in a tiny little venue (before the robots were born) was just incredible, or a 24-hour DJ set from Danny Tenaglia that the entire music industry attended. That was a particularly quiet flight home.
I was recently in Japan and managed to see a few really cool bands in some crazy little venues. Foreslimit in Tokyo was just insane, a real mix of live bands, DJ’s and crazy Japanese cabaret all under one roof – absolutely bonkers, but great fun. It was exciting to see how it all fused together on one night, you kind of had to just go with the flow and it all just felt unique to that city!
I also managed to get along and see the Team Labs art exhibition – just an incredible immersive experience and spac I’ve not experienced projection mapping, lights and sound used in quite the same way before.
LBB> As we age, our ears change physically and our tastes evolve too, and life changes mean we don’t get to engage in our passions in the same intensity as in our youth - how has your relationship with sound and music changed over the years
Daniel> Over time I’ve realised that my younger self was too quick to dismiss entire genres of music. I used to naively proclaim to the world, "I don't like Jazz" or "I hate metal." Now, I like to think there's no genre from which I can't find a track or artist to enjoy. This openness has made me more receptive to emerging artists and genres, especially as the lines between styles become increasingly blurred. It also makes for a much more exciting listening experience when you're not such a cocky know-it-all!
Being a music supervisor has unquestionably made me slow down and broaden my appreciation for various artists and genres that I might have previously overlooked. Not only is this beneficial for clients, but it also enriches my personal enjoyment, which is why I love what I do!
